[BCtom]

Does any one know how long Sky are going to charge the £10 per month for?

I have a HD tv but dont subscribe to sports or movies because I cant afford it and I dont want to have to spend £10/month to watch just a couple of HD channels.

Sky are offering the free HD box at the moment but if they got rid of the £10/mnth charge and charged the £49 for a box I think I would be more likely to go for it where as others (Virgin, Freesat) offer some HD channels for free.

[linkinpark875]

The fact that equipment is cheap or free means it's here to stay to fund it. I would rather pay £299 for a box with access to HD for nothing. I think there's little hope for it to be dropped anytime soon as it's still a premium product.

What I would like to see is more free HD channels.

[Andrue]

It's no coincidence that Sky has the most HD content. That £10pcm is the reason. Take that away and you'll lose the content.

[Nigel Goodwin]

Originally Posted by BCtom

Does any one know how long Sky are going to charge the £10 per month for?

It's not a 'charge' it's a 'subscription' and goes some way towards funding the HD programming you're paying for.

They aren't likely to drop the subscription for Sky Sports, so why should they drop the one for HD?.

What VM do is pretty irrelevant as they don't have enough HD to charge for at the moment.

Sky HD also has more HD for free than Freesat does, and as long as you don't buy a subsidised HD box, you don't need to take the HD subscription.

[Jarrak]

Originally Posted by BCtom

Does any one know how long Sky are going to charge the £10 per month for?

I have a HD tv but dont subscribe to sports or movies because I cant afford it and I dont want to have to spend £10/month to watch just a couple of HD channels.

The £10 provides a minimum of 15 PAY channels plus the four free channels (ITVHD with the new EPG). That may still not be enough content to justify the £10 a month but it certainly makes viewing the £10 as a subsidy to get cheaper hardware more attractive and cancel the HD sub a year later.

Sky are offering the free HD box at the moment but if they got rid of the £10/mnth charge and charged the £49 for a box I think I would be more likely to go for it where as others (Virgin, Freesat) offer some HD channels for free.

A Humax Freesat HD PVR costs around £250 retail so it's simply not practical to expect SKY to sell their SKY+HD for £49 retail as around £200 is considered the open market price for a new boxed unit.
VM off HD channels at no extra cost but then again if you want to watch BBCHD you have to pay a monthly fee unlike with satellite where it's free (after buying the hardware).

[Nigel Goodwin]

Originally Posted by Jarrak

A Humax Freesat HD PVR costs around £250 retail so it's simply not practical to expect SKY to sell their SKY+HD for £49 retail as around £200 is considered the open market price for a new boxed unit.

£200 is about the trade price (+VAT) of an HD box, not the open market price.

[Jarrak]

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

£200 is about the trade price (+VAT) of an HD box, not the open market price.

Only going on the prices you can find online which for SKY hardware has always been significantly lower than direct from SKY or their agents.
That has always been a slap in the face for existing customers looking to replace or upgrade, when you can buy cheaper third party it smacks of profiteering.

However the higher price you quote just underlines my point, without the subsidy even £49 is impossible so if the HD sub is the sticking point get the cheque book out and budget for something along the same lines of the Freesat PVR even though it has vastly lower production volumes and no subsidy, makes you think exactly what the gate price of SKY+HD actually is...

[Blake Connolly]

If you look in their last annual report, the £10/month is a key part of their business plan and is the reason why the box went down to £49 and there's the "free when you take movies for a year" offer now.

The £10 subscription isn't going anywhere for some time.

[Nigel Goodwin]

Originally Posted by Jarrak

Only going on the prices you can find online which for SKY hardware has always been significantly lower than direct from SKY or their agents.
That has always been a slap in the face for existing customers looking to replace or upgrade, when you can buy cheaper third party it smacks of profiteering.

And where do you think boxes cheaper than trade price come from?.

[Andrue]

Originally Posted by Jarrak

However the higher price you quote just underlines my point, without the subsidy even £49 is impossible so if the HD sub is the sticking point get the cheque book out and budget for something along the same lines of the Freesat PVR even though it has vastly lower production volumes and no subsidy, makes you think exactly what the gate price of SKY+HD actually is...

For someone like myself who is not likely to cancel Sky anyway it's a pretty good upgrade.

I actually viewed it as £189 (install+11 months sub) to replace an aging PVR3. In all probability I will continue the HD sub anyway having little else I can think of spending it on.

Of course if the new EPG turns out to be the horror that some claim I might be a bit more annoyed but for now I'm reasonably happy

[Jarrak]

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

And where do you think boxes cheaper than trade price come from?.

Trade price is not gate price although I get the point you are making but again isn't the whole OFCOM wholesale price versus rate card the same sort of thing

[StuartPlymouth]

I think the OP was working on the basis that the Sky+ subscription of £10 was eventually removed for all those paying for at least 1 mix.

I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same to happen to the Sky+HD payment, although not for quite a while yet, I imagine.

[derek500]

Originally Posted by StuartPlymouth

I think the OP was working on the basis that the Sky+ subscription of £10 was eventually removed for all those paying for at least 1 mix.

I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same to happen to the Sky+HD payment, although not for quite a while yet, I imagine.

Running Sky+ can't cost a great deal and the £10 charge helps Sky to get subscribers, where they wouldn't have to pay it.

You can see with the £10 HD charge where you're money is being spent!! You only have to look at the HD channels that don't charge an extra fee to see you don't get much for nothing. The BBC have already said they had to drop their bitrate for financial reasons.

[ShaunIOW]

Originally Posted by Jarrak

The £10 provides a minimum of 15 PAY channels plus the four free channels (ITVHD with the new EPG). That may still not be enough content to justify the £10 a month but it certainly makes viewing the £10 as a subsidy to get cheaper hardware more attractive and cancel the HD sub a year later.







A Humax Freesat HD PVR costs around £250 retail so it's simply not practical to expect SKY to sell their SKY+HD for £49 retail as around £200 is considered the open market price for a new boxed unit.
VM off HD channels at no extra cost but then again if you want to watch BBCHD you have to pay a monthly fee unlike with satellite where it's free (after buying the hardware).

I'd rather pay £250 for a HD box that had PVR functions even with no subscription, that I could choose the make of and that I could customise the EPG on and connect up a motorised dish for other services as well as receive sky on BUT seeing as Sky stipulate what make of box you can have, what you can use it for, cripple it if you stop subscribing and not let you shop around for a better third party box to use with Sky TV then the least they can do is supply them free imo.

[itvdig_csr]

Originally Posted by ShaunIOW

I'd rather pay £250 for a HD box that had PVR functions even with no subscription, that I could choose the make of and that I could customise the EPG on and connect up a motorised dish for other services as well as receive sky on BUT seeing as Sky stipulate what make of box you can have, what you can use it for, cripple it if you stop subscribing and not let you shop around for a better third party box to use with Sky TV then the least they can do is supply them free imo.

Yes - but you aren't Sky's target market in that case. Sky TV is a mass consumer product suitable for the average home environment, it's locked down and simplified for a reason.

Imagine if the EPG could be customised, I'm sure people would become quickly annoyed if their children moved things around or deleted them - straight on the phone to Sky to complain. Any yes it could be PIN protected but why it is in Sky's interests to build this in - especially as it means people can move their top placed channels away from the prime numbers. Sky News always 'First' - well it is when the majority of the subscriber base type 501 to go get their news.

Yes the removal of PVR when you no longer subscribe is harsh - but then they are a business and it's their carrot to keep you. Therefore the exit cost of Sky after they come round and put up your dish, subsidise your box cost is £250 for a new box should you wish to keep the functionality they previously provided with their channel package.

[loopie]

I can appreciate why Sky disable the recording function, but if I buy a car for example I don't want to pay a monthly charge to the garage to use the radio.

[alves]

Removing the multiroom charges would do me. The £10 each month on the first box I can live with but I don't particularly like paying the extra money for the multiroom box.

[DJ-badboy]

Originally Posted by Jarrak

VM off HD channels at no extra cost but then again if you want to watch BBCHD you have to pay a monthly fee unlike with satellite where it's free (after buying the hardware).

I'm assuming your referring to being outwith a contract?

If your outwith a contract on VM you can still get BBC HD free, it is only when you cancel the service that VM cease the package for that particular box and then the equipment is returned to them. Then your unable to view BBC HD, then again your unable to view any channel.

[itvdig_csr]

Originally Posted by loopie

I can appreciate why Sky disable the recording function, but if I buy a car for example I don't want to pay a monthly charge to the garage to use the radio.

But you presumably pay a garage for fuel to make the car work as intended?

Try comparing an ongoing subscription model business with Sky, like telephony or internet for example ... why if I cancel my broadband and have already paid for the router it would be unreasonable to disable internet access? or if I cancel my iPhone phone contract I can no longer have unlimited data despite having paid for the handset during my subscription period.

Love the analogy game, can take any two different business models and compare their apples and oranges with each other and decide the pear is best.

[jimbgibson]

A slight variation on the question.

If you are an existing SKY+ subscriber, can you install a HD box that you haven been given and just continue with a SKY+contract?

I appreciate that it would need to be paired, but can you just call up and say you have replaced your SKY+ box with a new one? Or will they twig it is an HD box and throw a wobbly?

[BKM]

Originally Posted by jimbgibson

If you are an existing SKY+ subscriber, can you install a HD box that you have been given and just continue with a SKY+contract?

I appreciate that it would need to be paired, but can you just call up and say you have replaced your SKY+ box with a new one? Or will they twig it is an HD box and throw a wobbly?

Not usually! Very many people have done this. Occasionally you get a poorly trained or new CS peron who thinks that people need to subscribe to SKyHD in this situation - but it can always get resolved eventually!

[Willie Wontie]

Originally Posted by jimbgibson

Or will they twig it is an HD box and throw a wobbly?

Whether they twig it is a HD box or not is irrelevent - you are allowed to spend your own money on whatever you like...

[Geordiesi]

is it only me who isnt really fussed about having to pay the 10 pounds for HD??

i remember the first timei switched it on and watched a speedway meeting in HD - the quality made it worth while and i still get a "good feeling" when watching football etc in HD.

i dont see the big fuss really - its no different to any of the subscriptions Sky offer - if you want it you pay, if you dont want it then dont pay???

[Philjwade]

Originally Posted by Geordiesi

is it only me who isnt really fussed about having to pay the 10 pounds for HD??

i remember the first timei switched it on and watched a speedway meeting in HD - the quality made it worth while and i still get a "good feeling" when watching football etc in HD.

i dont see the big fuss really - its no different to any of the subscriptions Sky offer - if you want it you pay, if you dont want it then dont pay???

Yes to all of the above. Nobody had an arm twisted to subscribe to Sky HD. Where else can you watch so much sport in HD sitting in the comfort of your own home. Lets face it going to a live Premier League match with a family of four for 90 minutes equates to much more than £120 - same applies to a visit to the local flicks. For us who subscribed to HD just for the sport content, everything else is now a bonus!

[suffolktoon]

Originally Posted by itvdig_csr

But you presumably pay a garage for fuel to make the car work as intended?

Try comparing an ongoing subscription model business with Sky, like telephony or internet for example ... why if I cancel my broadband and have already paid for the router it would be unreasonable to disable internet access? or if I cancel my iPhone phone contract I can no longer have unlimited data despite having paid for the handset during my subscription period.

Love the analogy game, can take any two different business models and compare their apples and oranges with each other and decide the pear is best.

Sky can only operate this model because of their monopoly position. If there was more than one reseller of the Sky TV channels they'd be falling over one another to provide deals to keep people happy.

You only have to look at the numerous freeview pvrs and the freesat pvr to see that there is no justification in levying a £10 per month charge to use the Sky PVR functionality. If you got a subsidised box then you should be able to make a one off payment to free up the box if you decide to stop subscribing. If like me you paid full price you should not have your box crippled when you decide that the programming is no longer worth the subscription.