[Jaycee Dove]

Following a link on TVtattle.com there is a report in the US media that the series Law and Order and Law and Order:Criminal Intent are at risk of the axe. Both are performing less well than they once did in the US; although better than many other shows and still earning money.

Law and Order: Special Victims Unit is safe and easily the best performer of the three. It has already been renewed for 2007 -8.

Apparently a meeting to discuss the future of the other shows is imminent and this may lead to the end of one or the other, or changes may be made to save money (such as cast cuts) or they may find other ways to boost ratings.

But it seems this is the first serious doubts against the 17 year old original series.

NBC seems keen to try to keep a show that gets a goods demographic and the US reports say that it only needs 4 more years to create the record for the longest running prime time drama on television.

Naturally the reports do NOT say on US television, but that is,of course, the reality. UK TV already has prime time dramas that have run longer than the existing US record but these (as usual) are ignored by the US media.

This time I do not mind if the belief that they will set a record keeps both these fine series on air.

Anyone any thoughts on how these shows can be revived and their future secured? What would you do to improve the situation?

I would draft in Andy Sippowitz from once rival series NYPD Blue. He could add the humour and personality lost with the sad departure of Lenny Briscoe.

[Squiggle]

Originally Posted by Jaycee Dove

NBC seems keen to try to keep a show that gets a goods demographic and the US reports say that it only needs 4 more years to create the record for the longest running prime time drama on television.

Naturally the reports do NOT say on US television, but that is,of course, the reality. UK TV already has prime time dramas that have run longer than the existing US record but these (as usual) are ignored by the US media.

What? Why? This isn't a pissing contest.

Um...when the US media says longest running prime time drama on television they are naturally talking about the US television market. They are not talking about other media markets out of the country (not unless they are doing some special report, which in this case, they aren't). It is US news pertaining to the US market. The longest running television program within the US. So they don't have to say US. If it were comparing it with other places around the globe it would have said so.

I don't think you gave this much thought. You misinterpreted what you read.

[Mr Giggles]

Tis the American way sadly, a fall in ratings and that's it, you are axed!

Look what happened to the Planet of the Apes TV series, axed after 13 episodes because there were other shows doing a lot better, mind you it was aired against an award winning show which didn't help.

[Squiggle]

Originally Posted by major-giggles

Tis the American way sadly, a fall in ratings and that's it, you are axed!

Look what happened to the Planet of the Apes TV series, axed after 13 episodes because there were other shows doing a lot better, mind you it was aired against an award winning show which didn't help.

The networks bear a lot of the blame. They don't schedule their commissioned programs properly. CI for example was doing very well on Sundays until the much overrated Desperate Housewives came along. Then it got hurt by it, but the ratings were still decent. Why they chose to move it from there to Tuesday nights opposite House no one knows. House is kicking its ass. They should have left it alone. The original L&O is showing its age. CSI:NY has taken over the 10pm reign (one that L&O owned for a very long time). NBC decides to move it to Friday nights. Its ratings are sagging that night. The only one of the franchise that survives any moves made to it is SVU.

I'd hate to see CI go as the stories are very, very strong and well done. So are the Mothership's. If one had to be chosen I'd say keep CI (although I secretly want both still on).

[Mr Giggles]

I wouldn't be too upset of Law and Order was axed, it's been a very long running show and perhaps it's time to finish it and allow the spin offs to continue. I HATE the idea of losing CI, that would be a crime.

[Squiggle]

Originally Posted by major-giggles

Tis the American way sadly, a fall in ratings and that's it, you are axed!

It isn't only the American way. Last time I looked, a very good drama in Vincent was axed as well wasn't it? Tis the way of the overall television market everywhere.

[Squiggle]

Originally Posted by major-giggles

I wouldn't be too upset of Law and Order was axed, it's been a very long running show and perhaps it's time to finish it and allow the spin offs to continue. I HATE the idea of losing CI, that would be a crime.

You're right giggles, it would be a crime if CI were to go. L&O did its job very well. It is a classic. Putting it out to pasture now wouldn't be a bad thing. Dick Wolf, though, does have an ego and it would be hard for him to admit this.

[MoreTears]

Originally Posted by major-giggles

Tis the American way sadly, a fall in ratings and that's it, you are axed!

Look what happened to the Planet of the Apes TV series...

You are lamenting the cancellation of a series 33 years ago? Way to hold a grudge. You couldn't think of a more recent example of a series cancelled because it dipped in the ratings?

[starsailor]

CI is a fantastic program. Would hate to lose it.

[quackaquacka]

CI is amazing, I hope we don't lose it. The original L&O is brilliant but has been going on for quite some time now, so it might be time to wrap that up.

[Murraymar]

I heard the networks have axed Studio 60 too. That is a brilliant show.

[Nuallain]

If they're going to do this would it not make more sense to drop L&O:CI and the cast of L&O while renaming SVU to just "Law & Order"?

[MoreTears]

Originally Posted by Nuallain

If they're going to do this would it not make more sense to drop L&O:CI and the cast of L&O while renaming SVU to just "Law & Order"?

That would make no sense at all. Law & Order and the spin-off SVU have always been two completely different shows with different formats and formulas -- different identities, in short. Both show's repeats run all the time in North America and their DVD sets sell well. Confusing, and angering, the fans of BOTH shows (not always one and the same people) with what you suggest would be unbelievably foolish. Honestly, no offence, but Dumbest. Idea. Ever.

[davidweller]

Originally Posted by Nuallain

If they're going to do this would it not make more sense to drop L&O:CI and the cast of L&O while renaming SVU to just "Law & Order"?

If L&O and L&O:CI both go, they might drop the 'Law & Order' and just call it 'Special Victims Unit', or revert to its originally proposed title, 'Sex Crimes'.

[Squiggle]

Originally Posted by davidweller

If L&O and L&O:CI both go, they might drop the 'Law & Order' and just call it 'Special Victims Unit', or revert to its originally proposed title, 'Sex Crimes'.

Why would they drop the Law and Order at all? SVU is part of that franchise.

[sgt.cryer]

I only ever enjoyed 1 of the Spin offs and tha was the one shown on ITV3 a while back. Cant remember the name of it though.

And vincent hasnt been axed!

[Paper Doll]

I'd rather they axe S.V.U. than C.I. , can't get past Ice-T's "acting".

[Jaycee Dove]

Originally Posted by Squiggle

What? Why? This isn't a pissing contest.

Um...when the US media says longest running prime time drama on television they are naturally talking about the US television market. They are not talking about other media markets out of the country (not unless they are doing some special report, which in this case, they aren't). It is US news pertaining to the US market. The longest running television program within the US. So they don't have to say US. If it were comparing it with other places around the globe it would have said so.

I don't think you gave this much thought. You misinterpreted what you read.

With respect, I do not think that I did misinterpret the comment. And I have thought about this - both now and in the past - for it is not the first time similar things have occurred.

In fact I started a thread on here last year (check it out) when a similar US report applauded Stargate for setting a Science Fiction TV record without reference to the fact that Doctor Who was way ahead in both duration and episode numbers. Whilst it simmered on here as a thread for a time it eventually ended up in the national media where commentators belatedly spotted the same issue and raised the matter more publicly than I did. In the end the facts were set straight for the record.

I love Law and Order and all its incarnations and hope it does set the US record. But, being pedantic or not, it is worth noting that it is only the US record, which was not what the news story said or implied.

But back on the real point of this thread - the future of the two series. I note an interesting suggestion in the US media report is that Law and Order and CI might both continue. The idea was that they could each produce fewer episodes (half series effectively) and share one hour slot. This would allow both to go on, but reduce costs and have the spin off advantage that there would be a longer run of new episodes in the US where repeats of old episodes are routinely slotted into new series breaking up the run to spread 23 episodes over 8 months.

It would be an interesting solution.

[Squiggle]

Originally Posted by Jaycee Dove

With respect, I do not think that I did misinterpret the comment. And I have thought about this - both now and in the past - for it is not the first time similar things have occurred.

In fact I started a thread on here last year (check it out) when a similar US report applauded Stargate for setting a Science Fiction TV record without reference to the fact that Doctor Who was way ahead in both duration and episode numbers. Whilst it simmered on here as a thread for a time it eventually ended up in the national media where commentators belatedly spotted the same issue and raised the matter more publicly than I did. In the end the facts were set straight for the record.

I love Law and Order and all its incarnations and hope it does set the US record. But, being pedantic or not, it is worth noting that it is only the US record, which was not what the news story said or implied.

We're going to have to agree to disagree. I get the feeling that it is a pissing contest for you. I don't know why? Quite frankly, I could care less. It doesn't have anything to do with real life does it? It's just television.

Moving on...

But back on the real point of this thread - the future of the two series. I note an interesting suggestion in the US media report is that Law and Order and CI might both continue. The idea was that they could each produce fewer episodes (half series effectively) and share one hour slot. This would allow both to go on, but reduce costs and have the spin off advantage that there would be a longer run of new episodes in the US where repeats of old episodes are routinely slotted into new series breaking up the run to spread 23 episodes over 8 months.

It would be an interesting solution.

Repeats are already slotted in between new ones.

NBC has been cutting back on their budget extensively. Many of their programs have been affected by this beginning with the reduction of ensemble casts. Las Vegas is the most recent series to get rid of two of their cast members.

[Jaycee Dove]

I am happy to agree to disagree and leave it at that, but I object to the crude words that you use. Unneccesary.

Quite simply I think that US TV often claims records without even thinking about other English language countries that might have produced longer running shows.

I have seen it often and it bugs me.

But, indeed, it is only TV and so merely an irritation.

I do not wish to row over this. Its not my nsature. But there was no need to characterise it as you have since it was merely an observation.

To clarify what I was saying about the repeats.In the UKwe screen a new series right through from episode one to the finale, with the only breaks for unusual events like a football match. In the US they screen some episodes, then some repeats, then new episodes, then repeats, to fill out the full September to May schedule with 23, or less, episodes. I find that very confusing but if I lived in the US I would probably not.

I think that the suggestion regarding Law and Order and CI is to film shorter series of each (say 14 or 16 episodes each) and run them both in one time slot creating a longer combined run of new episodes that would thus require fewer repeats slotted inbetween.

[patshar]

I know Sky had first run of L&O last year...does anyone know who is picking up the new series without the sadly departed Jerry Orbach.

[dfisher1]

Thats awful news, I hope it doesn't happen.

I'm a huge L&O fan and have NEVER missed an episode. I really hope it lasts long enough to reach the TV record books, it deserves it.

Part of the reason why its doing so badly is due to the new female detectives they have on L&O Original. According to the forums in the US, many viewers find these characters to be substandard and many people have taken a disliking to them. I think they need to sort out their cast in order to win back some of the disillusioned fans.

Another reason is that Rene Balcer, one of the main writers of L&O has left. The storylines, apparently, are'nt that good anymore and the writing jsut isn't up to Rene's high standards. I think Dick Wolf needs to consider bringing Rene back to the team to improve the storylines.

[Inky Binky]

Originally Posted by Murraymar

I heard the networks have axed Studio 60 too. That is a brilliant show.

"Studio 60" hasn't officially been cancelled yet although the show's future isn't looking very promising. It is on hiatus now until it can be rescheduled. "Hiatus" in the U.S. usually means the networks gave up on it. Cancellation is amost inevitable. But since Studio 60 was such a high profile show, there's a very small chance that they will renew it and give it another shot next season.


As for "Law and Order", the show had a very long run and successfully spinoffed 2 other shows. So it's not surprising that it may get the axe. On the otherhand, it is very surprising that "L&O: Criminal Intent" could be cancelled. I thought that was doing well.

[*Winterberry*]

If Criminal Intent is axed, my life will be officially over!

No more D'onofrio

Can't see them axing any of them tbh

[*Winterberry*]

Originally Posted by patshar

I know Sky had first run of L&O last year...does anyone know who is picking up the new series without the sadly departed Jerry Orbach.

I would imagine the Hallmark channel will, wouldn't like to say when though.
We are quite behind with CI....