Mr Saxon, The Official Thread (Doctor Who) - Doctor Who and Torchwood

Silent Timelord · 07-05-2007, 13:00

I have searched the forum and found no other 'official thread' so i have created this. Hopefully it will stop the forum being clogged up with lots of different Saxon theories like
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=572971
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=571616
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=573069
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=572774
(Great Threads but so many of them- 4 on the first page!!!!!)
The Doctor Who Series 3 arc word is 'Mr Saxon' whose name has appeared repeatedly; (Please tell me if I have missed anything or wrongly quoted.)

In Love and Monsters it was on the front of a newspaper, saying he was 'winning in the polls by 64%'

In the Torchwood Episode Captain Jack Harkness it appeared on a derilict dance hall wall in the form of a poster-which simply stated VOTE SAXON with a big X inside a rectangle (rather like an election poster)

In The Runaway Bride at christmas, when the tanks shoot The Webstar (Racnoss' ship) they say they have orders from 'Mr Saxon' implying he has a high up position.

In the opening episode of the series, Smith and Jones it appears twice, once on the radio, where Morgansten states 'Mr Saxon has been right all along, we are not alone in the universe...' This would imply that Saxon Belives in Aliens. Then at the very end, on the wall behind Martha as she enters the TARDIS, is the same election poster as seen in Torchwood.

In The Lazuras Experiment Mr Saxon appears to be behind the whole experiment, as Lady Thaw tells Lazuras 'Mr Saxon wont be pleased if things go wrong'. And finally the mysterious man who tells Marthas mum things, appears to work for Saxon. The final line of the episode-Marthas mum warns martha that 'the Doctor is dangerous, this information comes from Harold Saxon himself!'

So thats the FACTS! John Simm will be playing Mr. Saxon, but who is he? Hot favourite is obviously

spoiler:
The Master

but does anyone else have other veiws? Is he

spoiler:
an Axon, the Valeyard, Borussa, Rassilon, The Doctors Son or even (gulp) something to do with the Daleks! Or is he simply an innocent Prime Minister?

I know many will simply be repeating theories and anagrams, but this should bring them together, clear up the forum and be added to as we learn more! Happy Speculating

starsailor · 07-05-2007, 14:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by silent timelord

So thats the FACTS! John Simm will be playing Mr. Saxon, but who is he? Hot favourite is obviously

spoiler:
The Master

but does anyone else have other veiws? Is he

spoiler:
an Axon, the Valeyard, Borussa, Rassilon, The Doctors Son or even (gulp) something to do with the Daleks! Or is he simply an innocent Prime Minister?

For me the master is the only one which really works. The other theories are either too complicated, or don't really fit.

Given that RTD doesn't want to bring back too much from the old series, explaining things like Axon, Valeyard etc would be complicated. Most fans of the show don't even know who they are.

The Master however is different. Along with the Daleks and the Cybermen he's the best known villian, and unlike the others he's more human and less monster like, allowing for more of a battle of wits.

So I hope he's the Master, I think thats what everyone wants to see really.

The Slug · 07-05-2007, 16:06

Thank you for creating a thread with the intention of sharing all Saxon-related speculation. I was going to suggest it earlier today when the umpteenth theory thread started, so I hope you succeed in tidying up the forum!

My money is on the Master. I don't agree that concepts like the Valeyard are too complicated in themselves - it's all about how they're introduced. But the Master would make the most sense to me of all the ideas I've read.

I like that phrase of starsailor's - a battle of wits. That would be a breath of fresh air after the constant monsters - either rubber suits or CGI. It'll be nice to have a story that depends wholly on characters and plot, and there's a much better chance of that with the Master - saves a few pennies for even better effects in other episodes too!

A thought about the 'gas mask' scene. Is it possible that Saxon as PM has gassed the cabinet room himself, killing all his colleagues. Why else would he have a mask handy to keep himself alive? Is his drumming a countdown until he thinks the air is safe to breathe again?

mikevaughan · 07-05-2007, 17:23

There was another shot of John Simm, before the picture of him drumming his fingers on the desk.It looked like his face was on a tv screen,looking a lot less sinister than in the other clips of Saxon shown in trailers so far.

spoiler:
Perhaps an evil Time lord is slowly taking over his body, with the Lazurus Experiment and the events of Episode 11 Utopia, central to the completion of this process.

daveac · 07-05-2007, 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikevaughan

There was another shot of John Simm, before the picture of him drumming his fingers on the desk.It looked like his face was on a tv screen,looking a lot less sinister than in the other clips of Saxon shown in trailers so far.

spoiler:
Perhaps an evil Time lord is slowly taking over his body, with the Lazurus Experiment and the events of Episode 11 Utopia, central to the completion of this process.

Well if you saw the look on John Simms face and on the Doctors right a the end of the trailer - then could this be about to happen:-

Could be a spoiler if its on the right lines...

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/davecoope...ts5/morph3.gif

Cheers, daveac

mikevaughan · 07-05-2007, 17:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveac

Well if you saw the look on John Simms face and on the Doctors right a the end of the trailer - then could this be about to happen:-

Could be a spoiler if its on the right lines...

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/davecoope...ts5/morph3.gif

Cheers, daveac

Very cool if that did happen.By the way, what morphing software did youb use for that effect daveac. I'm in the early stages of trying to make my own Mcgann/Ecclestone mini episode regeneration.

Silent Timelord · 07-05-2007, 17:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveac

Well if you saw the look on John Simms face and on the Doctors right a the end of the trailer - then could this be about to happen:-

Could be a spoiler if its on the right lines...

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/davecoope...ts5/morph3.gif

Cheers, daveac

wow thats cool

daveac · 07-05-2007, 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikevaughan

Very cool if that did happen.By the way, what morphing software did youb use for that effect daveac. I'm in the early stages of trying to make my own Mcgann/Ecclestone mini episode regeneration.

Your in luck - the software was on the Computer Shopper DVD Issue 232 for June 2007 ie. current issue.

It's 'Morpheus Photo Morpher 3 Basic' - but you have to regester online

http://www.morpheussoftware.net/

Cheers, daveac

mikevaughan · 07-05-2007, 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveac

Your in luck - the software was on the Computer Shopper DVD Issue 232 for June 2007 ie. current issue.

It's 'Morpheus Photo Morpher 3 Basic' - but you have to regester online

http://www.morpheussoftware.net/

Cheers, daveac

Thank you, I'll have to track it down

Silent Timelord · 07-05-2007, 18:19

my personal theory is that the master escaped from the TARDIS in the parting of the ways and found a host body-Mr Saxon. So The doctor is the last of the timelords, but Boes not wrong

asto47 · 07-05-2007, 18:25

if you've got the trailer from the latest episode, play it on freeze frame and have a look at Saxon's ring. Looks a little gallifreyan to me...

Silent Timelord · 07-05-2007, 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by asto47

if you've got the trailer from the latest episode, play it on freeze frame and have a look at Saxon's ring. Looks a little gallifreyan to me...

a lot!

Gary_Stephens · 07-05-2007, 22:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by silent timelord

my personal theory is that the master escaped from the TARDIS in the parting of the ways and found a host body-Mr Saxon. So The doctor is the last of the timelords, but Boes not wrong

That wouldn't explain him being on present day earth. I would guess that escaping in Boom Town is more likely, and he then got stranded without a TARDIS in present time.

Silent Timelord · 08-05-2007, 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary_Stephens

That wouldn't explain him being on present day earth. I would guess that escaping in Boom Town is more likely, and he then got stranded without a TARDIS in present time.

well boom town would work too

platelet · 08-05-2007, 09:15

[quote=silent timelord;14402265]I have searched the forum and found no other 'official thread' so i have created this. Hopefully it will stop the forum being clogged up with .../QUOTE]

ROFL

Dalekanium · 08-05-2007, 15:30

well, my theory is that Mr Saxon is some sort of alien himself (maybe a dalek in human form, but with human characteristics), and he wants the doctor to get him back to his own planet, and he was the victim of some sort of nuclear explosion (gas mask) :/

ok, im not really sure.....
lol

Silent Timelord · 08-05-2007, 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dalekanium

well, my theory is that Mr Saxon is some sort of alien himself (maybe a dalek in human form, but with human characteristics), and he wants the doctor to get him back to his own planet, and he was the victim of some sort of nuclear explosion (gas mask) :/

ok, im not really sure.....
lol

welcome to the forums and i seriously hope it isnt a dalek story!

cy_bones · 08-05-2007, 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dalekanium

well, my theory is that Mr Saxon is some sort of alien himself (maybe a dalek in human form, but with human characteristics), and he wants the doctor to get him back to his own planet, and he was the victim of some sort of nuclear explosion (gas mask) :/
ok, im not really sure.....
lol

Interesting theory... I think this we have seen the last of Daleks / human Daleks for a while.

Saxon is either an alien (TimeLord or otherwise) or has had extensive dealings with them. So returning to a planet (or escaping Earth) is probably on his agenda.

If he is The Master, he may want to stay on earth to reap the rewards from his groundwork leading up to the election.

I think that the gas mask is just for an isolated incident!

Silent Timelord · 08-05-2007, 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by platelet

ROFL

what does this mean?

Matchu · 08-05-2007, 15:45

Why can't both

spoiler:
the master and the doctor's son

exist? I'm not saying they're the same person. But the face of bo said the doctor wasn't alone, it didn't imply there was only one other in existence like the doctor. Plus we know

spoiler:
the master

was fond of anagrams and word games; what better way to taunt his rival than with knowledge?

Just a random thought that occured to me.

Silent Timelord · 08-05-2007, 15:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matchu

Just a random thought that occured to me.

Random but good. could we have two season finales lined up with this theory?

Matchu · 08-05-2007, 15:57

Possibly, the business with Saxon leading upto the revelation of

spoiler:
the doctor's son

at the end of this series. Season 4 being the search for him and the unveiling of said individual at the end of season 4.

cy_bones · 08-05-2007, 15:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by silent timelord

Random but good. could we have two season finales lined up with this theory?

I expect 1 season finale, but the basis for next years story arc could be seeded...

Matchu · 08-05-2007, 16:03

The face of Boe says:

Quote:

I am the last of my kind, just as you are the last of yours, Doctor. But, know this, Time Lord....you are not alone

which seems to support the theory.

spoiler:
The doctor's son

wouldn't class as a time lord but I believe

spoiler:
The Master

would?

Unless he was exiled or something.

Mulett · 08-05-2007, 16:39

This is what David Tennent said on Parkinson on Saturday:

"The Face of Boe has told the doctor that he’s not alone in the universe. And whilst The Face of Boe isn’t lying, there isn’t really another Time Lord kicking about. It’s a bit more complicated than that. Oh yes, stay tuned. But also the Face of Boe story isn’t finished yet either."

So, perhaps he is what's left of the Master (haviing escaped from the TARDIS). Or maybe he is the Valeyard - which would make sense of the 'there isn’t really another Time Lord kicking about' comment.

07-05-2007, 13:00	#1
Silent Timelord Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 844	Mr Saxon, The Official Thread (Doctor Who) I have searched the forum and found no other 'official thread' so i have created this. Hopefully it will stop the forum being clogged up with lots of different Saxon theories like http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=572971 http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=571616 http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=573069 http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...d.php?t=572774 (Great Threads but so many of them- 4 on the first page!!!!!) The Doctor Who Series 3 arc word is 'Mr Saxon' whose name has appeared repeatedly; (Please tell me if I have missed anything or wrongly quoted.) In Love and Monsters it was on the front of a newspaper, saying he was 'winning in the polls by 64%' In the Torchwood Episode Captain Jack Harkness it appeared on a derilict dance hall wall in the form of a poster-which simply stated VOTE SAXON with a big X inside a rectangle (rather like an election poster) In The Runaway Bride at christmas, when the tanks shoot The Webstar (Racnoss' ship) they say they have orders from 'Mr Saxon' implying he has a high up position. In the opening episode of the series, Smith and Jones it appears twice, once on the radio, where Morgansten states 'Mr Saxon has been right all along, we are not alone in the universe...' This would imply that Saxon Belives in Aliens. Then at the very end, on the wall behind Martha as she enters the TARDIS, is the same election poster as seen in Torchwood. In The Lazuras Experiment Mr Saxon appears to be behind the whole experiment, as Lady Thaw tells Lazuras 'Mr Saxon wont be pleased if things go wrong'. And finally the mysterious man who tells Marthas mum things, appears to work for Saxon. The final line of the episode-Marthas mum warns martha that 'the Doctor is dangerous, this information comes from Harold Saxon himself!' So thats the FACTS! John Simm will be playing Mr. Saxon, but who is he? Hot favourite is obviously spoiler: The Master but does anyone else have other veiws? Is he spoiler: an Axon, the Valeyard, Borussa, Rassilon, The Doctors Son or even (gulp) something to do with the Daleks! Or is he simply an innocent Prime Minister? I know many will simply be repeating theories and anagrams, but this should bring them together, clear up the forum and be added to as we learn more! Happy Speculating

07-05-2007, 17:23	#4
mikevaughan Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,595	There was another shot of John Simm, before the picture of him drumming his fingers on the desk.It looked like his face was on a tv screen,looking a lot less sinister than in the other clips of Saxon shown in trailers so far. spoiler: Perhaps an evil Time lord is slowly taking over his body, with the Lazurus Experiment and the events of Episode 11 Utopia, central to the completion of this process.

08-05-2007, 15:45	#20
Matchu Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 70	Why can't both spoiler: the master and the doctor's son exist? I'm not saying they're the same person. But the face of bo said the doctor wasn't alone, it didn't imply there was only one other in existence like the doctor. Plus we know spoiler: the master was fond of anagrams and word games; what better way to taunt his rival than with knowledge? Just a random thought that occured to me.

08-05-2007, 15:57	#22
Matchu Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 70	Possibly, the business with Saxon leading upto the revelation of spoiler: the doctor's son at the end of this series. Season 4 being the search for him and the unveiling of said individual at the end of season 4.

07-05-2007, 16:06	#3
The Slug Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Birmingham Services: As a service to the community, Dr Who poll stats are on my home page! Posts: 4,049	Thank you for creating a thread with the intention of sharing all Saxon-related speculation. I was going to suggest it earlier today when the umpteenth theory thread started, so I hope you succeed in tidying up the forum! My money is on the Master. I don't agree that concepts like the Valeyard are too complicated in themselves - it's all about how they're introduced. But the Master would make the most sense to me of all the ideas I've read. I like that phrase of starsailor's - a battle of wits. That would be a breath of fresh air after the constant monsters - either rubber suits or CGI. It'll be nice to have a story that depends wholly on characters and plot, and there's a much better chance of that with the Master - saves a few pennies for even better effects in other episodes too! A thought about the 'gas mask' scene. Is it possible that Saxon as PM has gassed the cabinet room himself, killing all his colleagues. Why else would he have a mask handy to keep himself alive? Is his drumming a countdown until he thinks the air is safe to breathe again?

07-05-2007, 18:19	#10
Silent Timelord Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 844	my personal theory is that the master escaped from the TARDIS in the parting of the ways and found a host body-Mr Saxon. So The doctor is the last of the timelords, but Boes not wrong

07-05-2007, 18:25	#11
asto47 Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 239	if you've got the trailer from the latest episode, play it on freeze frame and have a look at Saxon's ring. Looks a little gallifreyan to me...

08-05-2007, 09:15	#15
platelet Forum Member Join Date: May 2002 Gender: Male Location: Cheltenham Posts: 2,807	[quote=silent timelord;14402265]I have searched the forum and found no other 'official thread' so i have created this. Hopefully it will stop the forum being clogged up with .../QUOTE] ROFL

08-05-2007, 15:30	#16
Dalekanium Forum Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Skaro Posts: 2	well, my theory is that Mr Saxon is some sort of alien himself (maybe a dalek in human form, but with human characteristics), and he wants the doctor to get him back to his own planet, and he was the victim of some sort of nuclear explosion (gas mask) :/ ok, im not really sure..... lol

08-05-2007, 16:39	#25
Mulett Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Essex Services: Virgin Media Posts: 3,275	This is what David Tennent said on Parkinson on Saturday: "The Face of Boe has told the doctor that he’s not alone in the universe. And whilst The Face of Boe isn’t lying, there isn’t really another Time Lord kicking about. It’s a bit more complicated than that. Oh yes, stay tuned. But also the Face of Boe story isn’t finished yet either." So, perhaps he is what's left of the Master (haviing escaped from the TARDIS). Or maybe he is the Valeyard - which would make sense of the 'there isn’t really another Time Lord kicking about' comment.